Bollocks to Brexit

Not cycling, but still important.
Iris
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Iris » 1 week ago

ransos wrote:
1 week ago
. I think it's remarkable that a split parliamentary party
It's not really that split, though, is it? On the one side you've got the Brexit party supporter Hoey, Kinnock and a handful of others who are scared for their seats and who don't understand that "leave seat" isn't the same thing as "must be leave to win" seat. Oh, and Jeremy Corbyn. On the other you've got everyone else. Plus the mass membership and now the cooked-up fudge of the unions.
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ransos
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by ransos » 1 week ago

Iris wrote:
1 week ago
It's not really that split, though, is it? On the one side you've got the Brexit party supporter Hoey, Kinnock and a handful of others who are scared for their seats and who don't understand that "leave seat" isn't the same thing as "must be leave to win" seat. Oh, and Jeremy Corbyn. On the other you've got everyone else. Plus the mass membership and now the cooked-up fudge of the unions.
The "handful" as you describe them were sufficient to sink parliamentary votes that could've given us a way forward, so I would be inclined to be somewhat less glib. Whether or not Remain-supporting MPs representing marginal Leave constituencies risk losing their seats is only something we'll know at a general election, but it's hardly an unreasonable hypothesis.

As for Corbyn, it's pretty clear that he could give you absolutely everything you want and you'd still find a way to be annoyed about it.
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Iris
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Iris » 1 week ago

ransos wrote:
1 week ago
Whether or not Remain-supporting MPs representing marginal Leave constituencies risk losing their seats is only something we'll know at a general election, but it's hardly an unreasonable hypothesis.
Only if you don't understand (a) that people change their minds, (b) that most of their vote, as survey after survey has shown, came from remain supporters, (c) that some people vote on issues other than Brexit.
ransos wrote:
1 week ago

As for Corbyn, it's pretty clear that he could give you absolutely everything you want and you'd still find a way to be annoyed about it.
No - if he gave me what I wanted, which is for him to recognise that he's a fucking disaster and stand down, I'd be delighted. Until then, I'll stay furious. Almost anyone else as leader of Labour would by now have killed Brexit stone dead. Instead we've got the two worst party leaders of modern times chasing each other to take the country down the plughole.
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ransos
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by ransos » 1 week ago

Iris wrote:
1 week ago
Only if you don't understand (a) that people change their minds, (b) that most of their vote, as survey after survey has shown, came from remain supporters, (c) that some people vote on issues other than Brexit.
Some people say that Remainers can be somewhat arrogant - and here you are high-highhandedly dismissing my post without actually responding to what it said. Anyway, let me try again: i) I said it was a reasonable hypothesis, not that we know for sure; ii) we know that the Labour vote is not evenly distributed and it holds a number of Leave-supporting marginals; iii) I haven't argued otherwise.

No - if he gave me what I wanted, which is for him to recognise that he's a fucking disaster and stand down, I'd be delighted. Until then, I'll stay furious. Almost anyone else as leader of Labour would by now have killed Brexit stone dead. Instead we've got the two worst party leaders of modern times chasing each other to take the country down the plughole.
This is a circular argument: you want him to stand down because he hasn't given you what you want.
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Mister Paul
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Mister Paul » 1 week ago

Anyone know why Kier Starmer hasn't been mentioned as a potential party leader?
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Iris
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Iris » 6 days ago

Mister Paul wrote:
1 week ago
Anyone know why Kier Starmer hasn't been mentioned as a potential party leader?
I think he has - frequently.
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Joan
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Joan » 6 days ago

Admin note: do we want to split off a "Party Leadership" thread?
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Rutabaga
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Rutabaga » 2 days ago

That idiot Jacob Rees-Mogg has put his foot in it while trying to link England's Cricket World Cup victory to Brexit - perhaps emulating Trump's foolish call to send some US-born political opponents "home"? If only the scorn being expressed about both pronouncements would stand some chance of sticking, but it probably won't.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... criticised
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LowlifeDes
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by LowlifeDes » 2 days ago

Nice to see that, during his silence over the last few months, he has been waiting to deliver something truly compelling.
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JohnToo
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by JohnToo » 2 days ago

Meanwhile, enjoy the NHS while you still can. If Boris wants an early trade deal with the USA, it will surely involve giving greater access to the NHS to US healthcare firms, or at least an understanding with Trump that this will follow. And that surely spells the end of many of the essential principles of the NHS, as those US firms will probably insist on moving away from a universal provision towards some form of get-what-you-pay-for model.
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Mister Paul
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Mister Paul » 1 day ago

Rees-Mogg - "We clearly don't need Europe to win [the cricket]"

Twitter - "Your Captain is Irish"
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LowlifeDes
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by LowlifeDes » 1 day ago

Mister Paul wrote:
1 day ago
Rees-Mogg - "We clearly don't need Europe to win [the cricket]"

Twitter - "Your Captain is Irish"
Not to mention
Jason Roy, South African
Tom Curran, Zimbabwean father and formerly registered as South African.
Jofra Archer, Barbadian (if that is the right word)
And last but a good way from least
Ben Stokes, who pretty much left his heart out on the pitch, Kiwi born.
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Mister Paul
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Mister Paul » 1 day ago

LowlifeDes wrote:
1 day ago
Not to mention
Jason Roy, South African
Tom Curran, Zimbabwean father and formerly registered as South African.
Jofra Archer, Barbadian (if that is the right word)
And last but a good way from least
Ben Stokes, who pretty much left his heart out on the pitch, Kiwi born.
Don't forget the pair of Muslims.
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LowlifeDes
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by LowlifeDes » 1 day ago

Mister Paul wrote:
1 day ago
Don't forget the pair of Muslims.
I see what you mean but they are more British than the other five.
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Dunckel
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Re: Bollocks to Brexit

Post by Dunckel » 15 hours ago

I have been enjoying a ripe Stinking Bishop.
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